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open view- veeru chennai boy
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This forum is locked: you cannot post, reply to, or edit topics.   This topic is locked: you cannot edit posts or make replies.    iCharts Discussions Forum Index -> Muthu Veerappan (iCharts User: veerappan)
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Author open view- veeru chennai boy
veerappan
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Post: #1   PostPosted: Fri Oct 05, 2012 4:21 pm    Post subject: open view- veeru chennai boy Reply with quote

1. its personal view.... some one tested today... suppose 5926 not closes and touching and falling we shd use those levels ... or 5656 below puts worst puts with that risk jockpot or let it be a loosing side of that money...

can u imagin 1080 to 867 on icici bank in cash ... just a small sell-off.. that means retail not coming inside

some one want to sell 650 crore let them ..how nse to cover back all ? one question... second... depth is not there means its done for fun with help of govt

third they want to test panic is coming or not

fourth...system cleaning process suppose really they want to show 6400-6666 then system shd not have retail longs...

: 5th... govt reforms ...euphoria urea ... malariya... like this... still market have own way and we have done any thing to market... congress want to prove?

: 6th.. fii will get nervous.. they cant sell the full qty .. our country is like this... so u cant go anywhere...so just trade trade just be with us for longer term .. is it a indication and warning to fii?

this is the conversation between me and runy....

just share your views... suppose if u have anything....

veeru
chennai boy
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sethu45
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Post: #2   PostPosted: Fri Oct 05, 2012 4:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Chennai boy, Your perception about the market is good. Finally what is going to happen nobody knows. As per my view its simple adjustment of gaps created during several occasions. But what are they going to do with rest of the scrips and f&o?? Million dollar question. Just forget everything look forward and carry our trades is the only methodology required at this time. All will come to light when political instability arises. Somene should tie the bell to the cat thats what happend today.

regds
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veerappan
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Post: #3   PostPosted: Fri Oct 05, 2012 4:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

sethu anna vanakkam vootla keereengala....

idhu potu patha vishayam thaan... vilambaram padam ipdi irundhudhunna
padam epdi irukkum?

parpom....piragu...
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vpatil4u
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Post: #4   PostPosted: Fri Oct 05, 2012 6:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nice points clarified...Its really a lot confusing that only 650 core selling takes nifty to 4950 and makes tragedy for about 1/2 hour.What will happen if real selling comes???
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rk_a2003
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Post: #5   PostPosted: Fri Oct 05, 2012 7:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

“The market circuit filter got triggered due to entry of 59 erroneous orders which resulted in multiple trades for an aggregate value of over Rs.650 crores. These orders have been entered by a trading member Emkay Global Financial Services on behalf of an institutional client. These non-algo market orders have been entered for an erroneous quantity which resulted in executing trades at multiple price points across the entire order book thereby causing the circuit filter to be triggered. These orders have been identified to a specific dealer terminal.

Emkay Global Financial Services has closed out the positions arising out of erroneous trades smoothly. The member has been disabled from trading.”


Above Statement is from NSE explaining the event. Well, if someone sold for 650 crores in Nifty cash market They can bring Nifty on to its knees. Well, give me two thousand crores and a superfast terminal for one day .I can short all nifty futures for 1350 crores and deploy 650 crores to sell nifty cash scrip’s and bring it to lower circuit[ even beyond it..to 14%(Allowed lower ckt is 10% and today it went to 14% lower)] and cover all my Futures at that level. You do the math’s how much I can profit?!

Let me tell you my experience. I was trading a –ww in IFCI in LTF. I was short at 30.35 and suddenly my terminal froze .I logged out and logged in to see cash nifty plunging to 5620 from 5760+.IFCI future showing some 29.50 that is within few seconds. I quietly covered my short with utter disbelief.

Now all of us know that this gap was much higher in Nifty scrip’s. What if I was trading a +ww and long in any one of the Nifty scrip. I would have covered my long at much lower level with panic, entertaining huge losses. The thought itself is frightening me. I would have been wiped out and may not be typing this.

Am I trading or gambling?!

NSE is saying it’s non algo orders.I don’t believe them.


Last edited by rk_a2003 on Fri Oct 05, 2012 7:36 pm; edited 3 times in total
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apka
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Post: #6   PostPosted: Fri Oct 05, 2012 7:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

vpatil4u wrote:
Nice points clarified...Its really a lot confusing that only 650 core selling takes nifty to 4950 and makes tragedy for about 1/2 hour.What will happen if real selling comes???


650 crs were traded in a flash of a second. u see total no. of buyers n sellers in any scrip. person whoever sold equities sold in a greater quantity that were already there in the mrng (mrng have low - gradually they increase).. so all those quantities in buy orders got hit and when no buyer left, it hit circuit as the price was at market.
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vinay28
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Post: #7   PostPosted: Fri Oct 05, 2012 8:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

apka/rk, the system has individual circuit filters in cash scrips but when simultaneous multiple scrips went into lower circuit, it could not protect NS from going below its circuit limit. This wouldn't have happened if 650cr sell was there in NF. This is clearly a system fault in NSE.

Such human errors only help in improving the system. Deliberate act is a diferent ball game. Till 9/11 nobody imagined it but after that everyone wondered why it did not occur to anyone before as it was so simple.

That's how fuzzy logic improves.
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apka
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Post: #8   PostPosted: Fri Oct 05, 2012 9:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

vinay28 wrote:
apka/rk, the system has individual circuit filters in cash scrips but when simultaneous multiple scrips went into lower circuit, it could not protect NS from going below its circuit limit. This wouldn't have happened if 650cr sell was there in NF. This is clearly a system fault in NSE.

Such human errors only help in improving the system. Deliberate act is a diferent ball game. Till 9/11 nobody imagined it but after that everyone wondered why it did not occur to anyone before as it was so simple.

That's how fuzzy logic improves.


the fall was less than 900 points vinay if calculated comes at 15% or so which is the nifty spot circuit limit
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rk_a2003
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Post: #9   PostPosted: Fri Oct 05, 2012 10:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

apka wrote:
vinay28 wrote:
apka/rk, the system has individual circuit filters in cash scrips but when simultaneous multiple scrips went into lower circuit, it could not protect NS from going below its circuit limit. This wouldn't have happened if 650cr sell was there in NF. This is clearly a system fault in NSE.

Such human errors only help in improving the system. Deliberate act is a diferent ball game. Till 9/11 nobody imagined it but after that everyone wondered why it did not occur to anyone before as it was so simple.

That's how fuzzy logic improves.


the fall was less than 900 points vinay if calculated comes at 15% or so which is the nifty spot circuit limit


No Apka,
Even in cash the allowed ckt limit is 10% only. It was a batch order therefore the system swallowed it as a batch and stopped accepting further new orders when Nifty reached 10% lower limit but executed the remaining swallowed batch orders thus allowing a further fall of 4%(Total 14%).That means you may even plan a fall of 20% by feeding a carefully Orchestrated Batch order to NSE server.
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apka
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Post: #10   PostPosted: Sat Oct 06, 2012 12:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

hmm maybe im wrong but this is what is coming for me......... 10% of 5800 is 580 points but our low is 4888 which comes to near 15% for nifty. As soon as 15% limit touched all cash scrips halted trading whether they were 10 / 15 / 20% down. Sbin was more than 10% down. Jp was under 10% down. Tata steel was 17% down. Reliance was down 20%

Whatever got sold, got sold as per no. Of buyers available in respective scrips till nifty hit 15% and all this happened in flash of a second.
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pkholla
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Post: #11   PostPosted: Sat Oct 06, 2012 10:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

1) Perhaps we should all write to NSE asking for slab based limits. What I mean is if the entire day's limits are +-10% then only allow +-5% for any rolling 2 hour frame. Now with everything computerized, this should not be too difficult.
2) Also as RK says a batch trigd the limits but NSE went on to execute the entire batch. Even here if limit reached, partially exec'd existing orders in the system also get frozen
3) How about a batch limit say Rs 10 cr for LT or Rs 20 cr for NF based on % of total market value of scrip?
Prakash Holla
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sankan_77
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Post: #12   PostPosted: Sat Oct 06, 2012 11:16 am    Post subject: It is not as biga s it sounds Reply with quote

There is a lot of talk about 650 cr loss.That is not correct .
See the order amount was 650 Cr and Nifty went down by 15 %

Now even if we assume that the bulk of the order got executed at the lowest point ( which is unlikely), the maximum loss will be 15% of 650 Cr ie 97 cr.

So Max loss can be 97 Cr in a worst case scenario and in all possibility the loss can me much lesser.

As per FII figures, they bought 4000+ cr yesterday , when market corrected..!

However FIIs were sellers in futures.

Since the cash buying is going on.it appears that dips may be bought after every correction.

However with the sudden crashes , the chances of retail investors getting back to the market has become really remote .!
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apka
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Post: #13   PostPosted: Sat Oct 06, 2012 11:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

you maybe right sankan. Good thinking. Order value was 650cr and some ppl thinking 650cr enough to circuit mrkt are in shock. Theyll be even more shocked if 97cr they read lol.

Economic times was saying emkays 80cr loss they have already money to pay n remaining they will do by next week. So it seems u r right Smile
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sankan_77
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Post: #14   PostPosted: Sat Oct 06, 2012 11:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Also note that , out of 650 cr only a part of it may have got executed. By the time it hit circuit levels. So if one assume that is the case , the net losses will come down even further.

Ultimately only those who has kept stoplosses would have lost their money ..!

Now, even after this incident if FII money keeps coming , then we are for a mamoth rally till the retail folks come back to the market .In that case a new high is likely . Watch out the FII cash buy figures in the next few days.
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Post: #15   PostPosted: Sat Oct 06, 2012 12:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

everyday dii are selling... Would be interesting to see holding % of fii dii mf retailers hni at current stage
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